Tags
Christianity, faith, GLBT, Heathen, lgbt, Pagan, Religion, religious freedom, rfa, RFRA
I think, with their protests of the RFA laws, the LGBT+ community has ultimately shot itself in the foot. True, they are at the moment winning a resounding victory. They have, ultimately won the culture war. If someone discriminates against a gay person or couple, regardless of the state’s own discrimination law status, a GLBT+ person is likely to win their case. Gay marriage is, at this point, looking like an inevitability, 66% of the nation believes that GLBT+ should have full rights, and 33% of people believe the only right that should be denied to gays is that of religious marriage.
However, Indiana has taught me many lessons with its RFRA law. Not that bigotry is alive and well, we all knew that about both sides. No, if it taught me anything it is that the GLBT+ community is willing to throw its allies under the bus, but also that they are literally willing to scorch the proverbial earth when it comes to people who dare to decent and stand up to them.
There’s an older video game I play called Total War. I have the 2nd medieval edition, and one of the things it teaches you in the combat portion is you always leave the enemy a route to escape. Because if you surround them, you will kill them to the last man, but they will fight to the death and that’s going to cost you. A man who has nothing left to lose is a man willing to make you lose everything to kill him.
Well, what we are seeing in Indiana is the proverbial “shooting of prisoners.” Not only are you not allowed to deny a GLBT+ anything, you are not allowed to have any sort of protections that could potentially allow you to deny a GLBT+ person anything…even if those protections are largely for protecting actions far removed from discrimination, and indeed are protections to end discrimination for non-GLBT+ people.
But let’s look at the idea here, as sold by the GLBT+ community. The RFA law allows a Christian shop owner the legal right to defend themselves and their beliefs if sued by a Gay couple should they refuse service for a religious ritual. The fact that it has become universally acknowledge that an attempt need to be made to try and protect a Christina business owner from the inevitable lawsuit and loss of their life’s work and business should they stand by what they believe is heinous. What does it say about the GLBT+ community that they believe they have the right to destroy anyone who disagrees with them to that degree?
I am completely against discrimination. I’m a minority too, and I don’t want to be discriminated against. But maybe it’s because I’m religious, I also do not want to force someone to violate their moral beliefs. Not like that anyways.
I mean, what we’re saying is that people should be forced to serve people and their desires even if it violates every moral fiber of that person’s being. So let’s say we go down to Starbucks and make them cater a wedding for NAMBLA. I mean, you know, why not. Discrimination is bad, and just because you object to a person’s sexual practices is no reason discriminate or deny them services.
I mean, sure, NAMBLA is a bunch of pedos who want to love underage young boys, but hey…discrimination is bad, and having a moral objection to an action is no reason for you not support it with your labor. So, you know, let’s just punish anyone who doesn’t want to serve pedos because it violates our “moral consciousness.”
I mean, it’s not like the LGBT+ might have thrown pedos under the bus…
Huh, oh wait, kinda looks like they did. I guess they couldn’t take an affront to their “morals.” I guess discrimination is okay.
Not to mention the hypocrisy of all those major businesses “supporting” the gay rights activists in Indiana and other states putting forth RFA laws. Pull your business from those states, will you? But let’s keep trying to increase business with all those Muslim nations who still EXECUTE THEIR GAY PEOPLE! Gods forbid a gay man can’t buy a cake, but it’s okay if he loses his head to Allah. Maybe Christians need to get a Muslim bakery as their poster child. Apparently it’s okay if they kill gays, they shouldn’t have any problems not selling them cakes, at least according to Apple and Walmart.
In the USA, there is the idea that you have a right to be “wrong.” That you do not have to agree with the majority and you should not be forced to be silent or obedient because the majority does not agree with you. That’s how the gay community managed to exist, much less rise to the present political power their insanely small numbers have. When a people who I believe are outnumbered as a population by the Jews, can crush an entire state under their boot heel, and are more than happy to do so because someone dares stand up to them, that speaks to me of tyranny. And if there’s one thing Americans are good at, it’s fighting tyrannies.
The GLBT+ community has shown they are taking no prisoners. They have shown that they are repeatedly willing to throw their allies under the bus. They did it with Nambla, they did it with the Dianics, they did it with the Larger Pagan community, and I’m sure there are others they have thrown under the bus. A group willing to crush its enemies and its allies quickly finds itself bereft of the latter, and overwhelmed with the former. The Christian Right now has a resounding rallying cry that can give them a line in stone to stand upon, but which even moderates on both sides of the aisle can be drawn to. And any religious minority out there, regardless of their stance on homosexuality, now sees that the GLBT+ has no interest in their ally-ship, which if those religions want their rights, they now have to ally with their traditional enemy, the Christian Right, who is more willing to protect their rights.
A man without mercy finds none for himself. This is a lesson the GLBT+ community is likely to learn in the years to come.
Son of Hel 
As to “America” being good at fighting “tyranny”, I am sure that was meant “tongue-in-cheek”, but the imagery of it seemed nice.
Yeah,
Idiots who run such an organization into such a disorganizing conundrum, will eventually have to face the ultimate result of their ill-conceived actions: FAILURE.
So, call this whole scene an EPIC FAIL on the part of these over-zealous “campaigners”. Just look at how idiotic the American feminist movement is stooping to, in order to make their (questionable) point.
Need we say more?!?
– Rev. Dragon’s Eye
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It is rather messed up the lengths these people will go to in order to get what they want. I watch a show on youtube called “this week in stupid” which is done by Sargon of Akkad…who views himself as something of a left wing liberal. Yet every week his show is filled with the most stupid shit…from the Left. As he put it, “I wan to find conservatives doing stupid shit and put it on here, but the Left has gone so crazy stuipd that nothing on the right even begins to compare.”
And the America Fighting Tyranny thing…actually was playing straight. Americans got their start “fighting tyranny” and its been one of their defining cultural traits. Now, Americans as a nation have conquered other peoples on their continent (but that is not tyranny) and they have owned conquered peoples as slaves (again, morally questionable but not a tyranny), but typically Americans have always attempted to follow the Roman Ideal of Bellum Iustim: Just War. (Who knew learning Religio Roman could be so educational?)
Barring a few examples (like the 2nd Iraq war, though the Afgan war was Bellum Iustim), nearly every war the USA has engaged in has been a Defensive War to protect its people (If you look at a lot of the wars with the native Americans for example, you will see that it was Indians and settlers who start fighting and then it escalated to the point where the Army was called in to protect American citizens. You can argue if the settlers were right or wrong, but it is the legal obligation of a government to protect its citizens in a conflict, even if that conflict started over those citizens potentially doing something wrong). Legally, the USA has always sought to act justly to its citizens. While certain states acted against this idea, the case can be argued that we don’t need civil rights amendments and laws because those rights were existent since the first signing. Technically, under the declaration and constitution, Gay Marriage is already legal because all citizens are given equal rights. In fact, the whole disagreement is on if marriage is a right or a privilege. If found to be a right, then legal.
Even though America now could count as more of an Empire than a Republic (Much like Rome) it (like Rome) has never stopped believing in itself as a fighter of tyranny (which was the justification of the the 2nd Iraq War). But having power over another is not itself tyranny. Tyranny comes when there is the complete suppression and subjugation of dissenting views…which America (the nation) has never supported even if some American (the people) occasionally do.
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Try living in today’s America!
There is definitely suppression of opposing thoughts and ideas now! Just look at what kinds of power the Federal Communications Commission has granted itself: “To regulate the internet as it does public utilities.” – And like the other utilities (like telecommunication, by phone and otherwise), it most definitely intends to tax it too (as well as “regulate” it). I’m sorry, but YES – THERE IS AMERICAN TYRANNY GOING ON RIGHT NOW. Even if the only discernable censorship and controlling of what views, beliefs, etc. seems to be coming from the private “media”, there is still the factor of controlling information, and this “perception management” that are all the hallmarks of tyranny.
I must humbly, but vigorously disagree here – on the idea that the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA is not “tyrannical”, because it most assuredly IS TYRANNICAL, and its pogroms upon the rest of the world (all done under Our good names – WITHOUT our consent) are indeed acts of tyranny, because they DO include controlling information and what is even known about what is going on in the battle-fronts.
The USA is NOT the same as it was when it was fighting for its own independence. What we have (and live in) is far alien from the “system” we once thought we knew.
So again, I must disagree with you on the thought of USA not being tyrannical. It IS, and I can prove it, just as so many others of us USA-Citizens can. The total control is not quite complete, but it is most certainly there. THAT is why the big push to completely control the internet, under the guise (and big LIE) of “net-neutrality”.
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Okay, I will give you the present day Government is certainly acting in a Tyrannical manner. I suppose what I was speaking to more was it’s People. The People of America are not tyrannical, and oppose tyranny (at least most of them) and in the Past Government again, opposition to tyranny was the primary goal. Given the last forty years (and especially the last ten) the government has indeed betrayed the ideals of the People and its fore-bearers.
You have to bear with me on some of this. I’m a historian, so I tend to look in at least hundred year segments, so going by mere decades is a bit…narrow for how my mind works, lol.
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Actually,
Out of their ignorance of reality and the true nature of our Natural Rights, such a tyrannical government can only be possible by a majority who are, themselves, tyrants. It all starts with the tired, old expression: “There ought to be a law . . .” We have had perhaps had a “free society” for at best, about thirty years out of the entirety of the existence of the United States of America. The attempt at passage of the Alien Act and the Sedition Act were among some of the earlier attempts at political power grabs. The beginnings of some of the worst injustices to our rights were decided when our Supreme Court granted organizations and other artificial entities rights ON PAR with the peoples’. This was about in the 1840’s.
There is far more than just a few decades involved. There is a pattern. Even the old maxim: “Rome was not built in a day” still has relevence and is apropos to today’s events. Often times, the “church” throws its weight behind aggregious policies too.
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