So, it’s bit a bit. I’ve been super stressed by a bunch of stuff, have some issues I’m dealing with that…hopefully are not serious but are concerning. And I have done my level best to stay out of shit. I was actually succeeding, focusing on the holy day of Halloween coming up, planning out what I was going to do as part of my Helatru practice, and just let go all the toxic stupidity that seems to have swept over everyone.
And Some Mother Fucker Had To Ruin It.
And who is this fool, that dares desturb the Son of Hel when ghostly preparations and haunted relaxations are upon him? Why, it’s some idiot named Tyra Ulfdottir who calls themselves the “Rational Heathen,” whom I doubt very much is a Rational person and whose definition of Heathenism seems to be defined by the intolerant dogma of Huginn’s Heathen Hof!
Don’t believe me? The first image on their post is this:
Now, I’m sure Upsal can correct me, but I’m going to guess that is memebers of the AFA in front of their shiny new Hof (one of the only Hof’s in the US, if I’m not mistaken). Also, if I am not mistaken, the AFA has yet to protest any funerals, pyre or otherwise. So right off the bat Ulfdottir is both lying and insulting the AFA and it’s members. Frankly, I’ve seen Wars, much less Holmgangs, start for less slings and arrows than the AFA has suffered.
But let’s get to the article.
With all the Asatru Folk Assembly crap being flung around, you’re probably wondering what The Rational Heathen has to say...
Actually, no I wasn’t. I really didn’t care what anyone had to say about it except the AFA, and that was mostly concern over their internal sayings about internal matters. As far as I am concerned, HHH and the rest of the Dec127 crowd can go shove their heads in holes, for all the business anyone has dictating the religious practices of another organization they do not belong to.
…Well, if you haven’t read my posts before, now is the time. But I digress…
Before we get started, I must point out that I didn’t mean to insult the Westboro Baptist Church…Oh fuck, who am I kidding?…
Right, so this is happening.
…I most certainly did. In a stunt that could only be pulled by people of that kind of caliber, the Asatru Folk Assembly, has determined that straight whites who uphold what I can only consider “traditional” Christian roles are allowed in their group…
Right, because compairing the WBBC to the AFA is an insult to the AFA and wait a minute…
Only white people who uphold traditional Christian values are allowed in the AFA?
Only white people who uphold traditional Christian values are allowed in the AFA?
WHAT THE FUCK DID I JUST READ HERE!?
Right, just to remind everyone what Ulfdottir is talking about, she is talking about the statement from Flavel for the AFA:
Which did talk about how the AFA liked their peoples to be European in origin and did like their men and women to follow the traditional mores and ways of men and women…in relation to the pre-10th century ways of Heathen Norse and Germanic peoples.
Not the modern traditions of Christians.
So right now I’m faced with two choices. Either option A) Ulfdottir is so gods damned stupid she can’t figure out that a Heathen organization would mean Heathen Traditional Values, or option B) Ulfdottir is not a god damned idiot and is lying to her audience.
Given that they start off this post with an outright lie…
…That means, my friends, that “blacks need not apply” and that LGBTs and other minorities aren’t allowed to join in their goosestepping sessions. Hel’s bells, I don’t fit the submissive, subservient woman, so you can betcha I am most certainly not welcome.But I may try to get in just for a laugh and to spy on them until they kick me out. Can you imagine me on their boards?
We hates Nazis, precious. We hates it forever!
Well, while the AFA may…apparently be literal Nazis, I can at least say in their defense that they are not complete history revisionists who are so high off their own assvapors that they confuse the traditions of Heathens and Christians.
That being said, I doubt you’ll find many Nazi’s in the AFA, but you will find them in Helheim, so here’s the obligatory Hot Nazi Girl.
Tolerance: We’re Not Asking Them to Get Married to a Minority
No, you’re just calling them Nazi’s because they say they don’t want to…
In the words of the AFA states:“…we believe gender is not a social construct, it is a beautiful gift from the holy powers and from our ancestors. The AFA celebrates our feminine ladies, our masculine gentlemen and, above all, our beautiful white children…”[emphasis mine]Well, okay then. Whether or not you agree with the LGBT lifestyle, whether you believe gender is a social construct or nature, whether or not you choose to marry a person of the color of your skin, whether you prefer powerful or demur women or men, the reality is that we must live honorably.
“We must live honorably.”
Wow, that is so rich coming from someone who has repeatedly lied in their post from the start.
I mean, I’m not sure I want to accept the reality that someone with the credentials of being: a Scientist, Engineer, Author, Writer, Skeptic, and General Curmudgeon might actually be incapable of intelligent thought and deductive reasoning, much less actually presenting situations honestly, but yet here I am presented with incontrovertible evidence that that is exactly what is happening before my eyes. There really is only one Rational answer.
…That means living to a moral code that honors our ancestors and our gods. We are not judged like Christians are with their god, but we ARE judged by our actions. Were they honorable? Did they uphold the heathen codes of conduct?
Right, we Heathens are not judged like the Christians are judged, we’ve got different ethical codes than they do so…why is Ulfdottir being so judgemental here? Honestly, the Gods have taken no action against the AFA since that statement was put out (and I was under the impression that our Gods were not ones to stand idly by). Indeed, the only reactions I’ve seen is a bunch of people deciding they get to be moral busy bodies who call their enemies literal Nazis.
If we were to bring up the ancient Heathen codes…yeah, the AFA has acted honorably and within the codes of conduct to uphold traditional values for their people and even our common ancestors. I mean, if we’re talking ethnological preferences (though not exclusions) and a general…not very LBGT pro attitude. I mean, Argr (sp) was one of the worst insults…
On the other hand, Declaration 127 is full of dishonorable conduct that violates the codes of honor.
People are many things in this world. They are husbands, wives, fathers, mothers, Christians, Heathens, Jews, Catholics, Muslims, Atheists, daughters, sons, soldiers, doctors, dentists, plumbers, scientists, unemployed, teachers, friends, volunteers, firefighters, EMTs…the list goes on and on. But the first thing every person is is a human being.
Unless they’re members of the AFA, who are all nothing more than apparently racist Nazis who are so bad that compairing them to the WBBC is an insult to…the WBBC. At that point, I’m pretty sure Ulfdottir has denied their humanity completely.
Also, not to be a greater asshole than I already am, but what the Hel do Christians, Jews, Catholics, Muslims, and Atheists, have to do with anything the AFA said or…even this discussion within Heathenism. All those people Ulfdottir just listed are not Heathens, and by dent of being those things, cannot be Heathens. Because with the exception of Jews (both religion and race) and Atheists (don’t get me started), if you are one, you cannot be some other religion, and for the two exceptions…you’re still a mother fucking Heathen before you’re a Jew or an Atheist. Or at least you should be.
If race is indeed a construct, then I really have to ask Ulfdottir what her problem is with the AFA’s position. I mean, it’s just an arbitrary line in the sand. Same as if some Lutheran church said “we like our men to be men, women to be women, and our babies to be Lutherans.” I mean, really, if “Race is made up” and a bunch of people wanna go and make themselves up as a group of people, and they want all those people to look alike for whatever reasons then…who gives a fuck?
I mean, in the view of “construct” all the AFA is really saying is “we’re Goth kids, and we like our people to be Goths, and we don’t care about Preppies.”
Honestly, the only reason to get mad about such divisions is if you don’t believe they are a construct, but an actual, real, tangible thing. At least, if you’re a normal, rational person. Normal, rational people do not get upset over imaginary differences that different people put themselves into. I mean, Ulfdottir’s attitude here makes more sense if one is looking at it from the attitude of “race is serious business” rather than “goth kids need to stop being anti-preppy.”
…Judging the person by their sexual orientation is beyond idiotic. If you have cancer, you don’t tell the greatest cancer surgeon that you don’t want him to operate on you because he’s gay. You don’t ask the airlines about the pilots who fly you somewhere if they are your color or if they are straight. You don’t stop depositing money in your bank account because the teller is Muslim…
You do if they blow up the bank. ba dum tiss.
…Chances are you don’t even know those facts about those people. You just hope the doctor is good, the pilots will get you where you need to go safely, and the teller inputs the right information. Why is this so hard for some people? Treat the people with respect that are trying to help you. Treat everyone as the human beings they are and if they prove not worthy of your respect by their actions, you can modify it. It’s that simple.
Right, and Ulfdottir doesn’t know the people in the AFA, doesn’t know that they are Nazis or racists, or anything like that. What Ulfdottir is doing is sing “a group of people” who has “socially constructed” a “race” and decided that because they’re not living by her definition of a “Good life” that they’re horrible racist Nazis.
She is dehumanizing people for the crime of her perceiving that they’re dehumanizing people when their statement was…mostly about humanizing “white straight people living a traditional heathen life.” Which is apparently horrible even though race is….a make believe construct (as may well be sexuality and gender).
The Dirty Laundry — or Toleration for Goosesteppers
It’s no secret that Heathenry has its share of dirty laundry. Most are in the form of white supremacists and Nazis who think that by worshiping our Northern gods, we automatically cut out other races and minorities…
Well, given that many other Pagan paths seem to have problems with pedophiles, child molesters, and rapists…I’m actually pretty happy we’ve apparently only got Racists. I mean, all a racist is fundamentally is an asshole (and apparently an asshole over made up shit), which honestly is a Helheim of a lot better in my personal book than people who rape both adults and children. Not to mention Christianity with its….many examples, and Islam with it’s pedophilia and terrorism.
Can we just take a moment to reflect on how lucky we are? All we got is a bunch of “in group assholes.” They’re not murdering, they’re not raping, Hel, most of them just appear to want nothing more than to go into their homes and shut the proverbial door. Bloody Hel, can we get a Nobel Peace Prize over here for the Religion least fucking people over violently?
…The truth, however, is far from what the goosestepping crowd wants people to believe. The Northern peoples didn’t care about the color of your skin. They were an inclusive group who married into other cultures and fought beside those who considered them allies, regardless of their perceived orientation. In fact, there were “black” Vikings. No, kids, we aren’t pure. Deal with it.
Tell me, Ulfdottir, how many of those “marriages into other cultures” were because our ancestors had carted off women of different races to be their sex slaves? Oh, and that “fighting beside those we considered allies” was Mercenary work. Our ancestors fought because they got paid, not because of “all humanity is one people.”
And sure, our ancestors didn’t care about your skin color. They’d kill and rob you regardless of it. Ours was a vast Warrior society stretching from Ireland to Arabia and we fucked, raped, drank, fought, extorted, and pillaged our way through life. We did it for ourselves, for the Romans, the Greeks, to anyone with enough coin to steal or enough coin to have us kill their enemies, it really didn’t matter.
All that “inclusion” was nothing more than practical greed, lust, and violence.
We have plenty of folks in Heathenry who dismiss the white supremacists as not being true heathens, and because they are not part of their kindred they aren’t a problem, but the reality is that if we have one group who tolerates this bigoted behavior, it casts a bad light on all of us. You might as well be called a racist or intolerant bigot, yourself. No matter what you think or believe, if the AFA insists that unless you fit their bigoted criteria, you can’t join, you can bet the public and the media are going to color us all in that light.
Guilt by association.
See, if race is a construct, a make believe thing, it makes no sense to get angry over someone being racist. Or even a group of people being racist. They’re making shit up, being idiots over nothing, and probably harming themselves in the long run.
But Ulfdottir could be painted by the brush of guilt, and she can’t have that. Probably because she’s friends with a bunch of people who make a very big deal about race, sex, gender, etc, and if you don’t agree with their attitudes you’re a horrible white hetero-normative supremacist who they will harass until you lose your job, your life, and any chance at a future you might have. All in the name of “inclusivity.”
This post by Ulfdottir reaks of her fear. Fear that she will be judged by her people, judged for who she is. Fear, ultimately, she is as evil as she believes the AFA to be, because she too is a Heathen like them. And If They can Believe This, that means some part of her could also believe it as well. And I’m sure that’s terrifying. Something Ulfdottir has secretly had to fight against every time she’s with more “inclusive” people.
It’s not enough to say you are against racism, bigotry, and chauvinism. The fact that AFA promotes those “values” is enough to make you look racist, bigoted, and chauvinistic to the rest of the world. Because our religion has such small numbers, we can’t afford to have these people among us.
And…I still don’t care. I don’t care if I look racist, bigoted, or chauvinistic to the rest of the world. I’m a mother fucking Heathen, the world can go fuck itself as far as I’m concerned. Why is it that so many Heathens who embrace the “I do not kneel before my Gods, I stand beside them” suddenly kneel with terrified abandon to the whims of the rest of the world?
It’s fucking bullshit cowardice is what it is. Fucking have some spines.
Also, yeah, our religion is of small numbers. And you know who has the largest amount of those small numbers? the AFA and the Folkish (most of whom share similar views to the AFA in these regards).
Ulfdottir wants to purge Heathenism of its majority because they do not bow to the whims of the politically ideological minority whose position is religiously questionable at best.
Look, I’ve studied into this stuff and sure, there is a place for “inclusive Heathenry”…so long as we don’t give to many fucks about shit. The instant we start giving a fuck about historical accuracy and historical practices, that “inclusiveness” starts shrinking…because most of the examples of “inclusion” are not anywhere near being actually inclusive.
Our Stories Do Not Support the AFA Stance
My good friends at the American Asatru Association drew up this little statement that brings our religion into perspective. Throughout our stories, our gods and goddesses prove time and again that they don’t behave anything like what the AFA wants to see in terms of traditional gender roles. Our gods have had interracial relationships, have changed genders, and have crossdressed. ..
Okay, here’s the first thing….
HAVE ANY OF YOU DEC 127 MOTHER FUCKERS ACTUALLY ASKED WHAT THE AFA MEANT BY TRADITIONAL GENDER ROLES?
answer, no, no they mother fucking have not. Not once have I seen it, anywhere. Nope, everyone just went off on some 1950’s vision of traditional Christian marriage and assumed that’s what the AFA wanted. Zero fucks were given about actually finding out the pertinent information here. Hel, zero fucks were given about even logically deducing that the AFA mean TRADITIONAL HEATHEN GENDER ROLES like I did.
Now, did our Gods have interracial relationships? I don’t know, I thought Race was a construct and didn’t actually exist. At least according to Ulfdottir. Now, sure, the Aesir did it with the Jotuns, but given that the Aesir were born from the Jotuns I’m not sure I’d call that interracial. Dwarves were born from maggots, so I suppose that’s more bestiality than interracial. I mean, there’s some question when it comes to Vanir and Alfs, but again were talking about “race is a construct” and Alfs would be a different species, not a different race.
And sure, our Gods have changed genders. Well, A god changed Gender. Loki. When he turned into a female horse. And got pregnant. By a horse. And then switched back to being a male. So…not sure what you’re implying about transgenderism there but I don’t think it’s all that positive. That transgenderism is a choice, maybe.
And yes, our Gods did cross dress. Thor did it, and everyone fucking laughed at him because of how unmanly it was. This was not behavior that was lauded as godlike, this was behavior that was mocked because he’d lost his metaphysical dick!
See, this is what I was talking about the “inclusive examples.” Everyone wants to use them as examples of being racially and sexually inclusive, while ignoring most of it was about bestiality, metaphorical castration, and intersperses erotica. I just hope I’m around for the day Ulfdottir comes home to find their spawn in bed with a dog pounding away at them and get told “Loki did it, don’t judge my sexuality, it’s okay according to the Lore.”
…If you need to look for goddesses who are not overly feminine, we can point to Skadi and Freyja. Any women who handle weapons are not “traditional.”..
Wow. I never thought I would find some one so ignorant of their own religion.
Freya and Skadi are not feminine goddesses. Mother Fucker, Freya is the literal Goddess of Femininity! I had Freya as a Patron Goddess for nearly 6 years, and I can tell you, she is feminine as fuck! Oh sweet Hela my brain hurts from the sheer ignorance. Fuck it, Skadi is still one of my Patron Goddesses and has been for 12 years now, and she’s the epitome of a feminine Norse Woman! Our ancestresses were hunters, and fighters, and home makers, and did their hair up and put on make up and could tweeze their eyebrows with one hand and gut a man with another…
IT WAS MOTHER FUCKING TRADITION TO TRAIN ONE’S DAUGHTERS HOW TO FIGHT!!!!
My gods, a pleb who had done nothing but watch bad Viking movies would apparently have a better understanding of traditional women than Ulfdottir here does…and she claims to be a practicing Heathen? If this is the quality of Huginn’s Heathen Hof’s leadership or even membership then…gods damn it, I am sorry.
…The gods have had children with Frost Giants, Humans, and even a horse. I am not saying that I approve of incest and bestiality (I most certainly do not), but we can’t point to our religion and claim that there is a basis for exclusion when it comes to people of other ethnicities and other sexual orientations.
And look at the hypocrite outing themselves as a bigot.
“The gods give examples of incest and bestiality (that I used to argue for inclusion), but I don’t think we should include those behaviors.”
Well why the mother fucking Hel not? I mean, if it’s good enough for the Gods, it should be good enough for us Mortals. And it was certainly good enough to go on “anti-racist” tirades and demand “gender inclusivity” so why the Hel should not also allow the incest and the bestiality. They’re better represented as having actually been done.
Cause either you ban all the “exclusions” Ulfdottir, or you don’t. You don’t get to say “well, the behaviors I don’t want can be excluded even if they’re in the Lore, but those people over there can’t exclude the ones they don’t want because I want them and I’ll use the lore to prove it’s okay.” At that point, you’re not different than the Christian who bashes gays but insists he can eat pork, despite the fact the laws ban both those behaviors according to their religion.
Except in this case the lore actually does permit the behaviors you are perfectly fine with banning.
Heathenry Should Be Open to All, Not Just White, Heterosexual Bigots
Such as yourself Ulfdottir? I mean, there’s no picture of Ulfdottir connected to the post, but they haven’t mentioned being a PoC so I’m going to go with their white. They haven’t mentioned being GLBT, so I’m going to go with they’re heterosexual. And they most certainly are a Bigot. Big fat raging bigot at that.
The good news is that yes, Heathenry is open to more than just white, heterosexual bigots.
The reality is that Heathenry should be open to all except bigots, whether they are of a different ethnic background or have ancestry from Northern peoples, whether they are gay or straight, or whether they are crossdressers or dress according to whatever custom society expects…
Oh, if Heathenry is closed to bigots, well I’m afraid you’re out then Ulfdottir. Along with everyone who signed dec 127 as I showed in the past. Cause…damn, you some heavy ass bigots, you are. Using the lore to demand behaviors you want, even when the examples really are for other behaviors. Behaviors you yourself admit you would continue to see banned in Heathenism.
Yeah, I hate to say it, but really you’ve argued yourself out of the religion. Huginn’s Heathen Hof too, since they posted this shitstorm of an ignorant click-bait hit piece.
…I have often said that we need to keep our doors open to everyone, and to make Heathenry a big tent, whether or not the person is of a different skin color or ethnicity, whether they are LGBT or heterosexual, and whether they have beliefs that shift toward Wiccan and Recon. There are places for these people within Heathenry. Opening our doors to those who are different, but are not Nazis or white supremacists, means that we allow our religion to thrive and grow. Staying in lock step with those who would exclude them makes absolutely no sense.
Really, all this means is that Ulfdottir is perfectly fine with bigotry, exclusion, and hating people based on nothing more than ideological differences. Sure, their criteria might be different, but it’s just as exclusionary, bigoted, and in some ways even worse than anything the AFA is supposedly doing. Because at least the AFA is like “well, we want to preserve our people” where as Ulfdottir is doing it because she quite literally wants to destroy people.
And destroy people for wanting to preserve their “constructed” group. What Ulfdottir is doing is basically saying “there’s no place in our society for X group of people, because that group of people wants to retain its identity based on visual characteristics.” Goths, Heathens, Jews, Rastafarians, its the same principle. Because X-Group wants to preserve itself as it defines itself, it has to be destroyed for the sake of Ulfdottir’s bigoted and intolerant peace of mind
Or to put it even more simply: “It’s okay to be a Goth kid, you can wear bright colors, listen to taylor swift, be part of the cheer-leading team, anything you want. But don’t you dare insist that you as a group of Goth kids get to dictate that everyone in your group wear black clothes, listen to metal, and love darkness. Because that’s RACISM.”
At this point, I applaud those groups who have taken a stance against bigotry and chauvinism…
Well, I’d thank you for the applause, but I kinda feel that your approval fills me with shame.
…While I don’t necessarily agree with all their beliefs, I must say that they are awesome groups who are willing to stand up against what is obviously wrong. To the Asatru Folk Assembly, I would say that if you insist on being bigoted and upholding false, and ultimately Christian, beliefs by insisting on being racist, misogynistic, and homophobic, then I denounce you. You are not Heathens, even if you claim to worship our gods.
What is obviously wrong.
Well, there’s a lot obviously wrong, and I’ve done my best to point it out. I’m sure I’ve missed a few bits, but damn it, I tried.
At this point, I don’t know if Ulfdottir is merely ignorant or malicious. While it would easily be believable to go for the latter, given the outright lies she made up…the level of ignorance displayed makes it really had to say. Maybe, it’s both, a malicious ignorance, born of ideological bigotry.
That being said, Ulfdottir is no heathen. By their own standards of behavior, and their own dictates of what is and is not acceptable, she has proven that much, at least. I don’t consider it my place to judge a person’s faith, but really I can only accept the truth of their words and her words state that Tyra Ulfdottir is no Heathen, even if she claims to worship our Heathen Gods.
Frankly, like the clip above, I think we are all perhaps a little dumber for having listened to this post of hers. May the Gods have mercy on her soul.